#does it make enough sense for why Rumple would have a complicated relationship with Pan

[fantasticgothicpeachsludge]

I’ve been thinking about this since I posted it and now I’ve completely integrated new Pan lore into my ouat headcanon

So hear me out, what if Peter Pan (instead of being an abusive old man in the body of a child) was a sixteen-year-old boy living in the enchanted forest in the same village as Rumplestilskin when he was a child and was like an older brother figure to all the children in the village, playing pretend with them, doing shadow puppet shows, playing his flute for them, reading stories to them, maybe even teaching them how to read, etc.

But he’s especially close with Rumple, often there to take care of him when his father wouldn’t. Even going into the tavern himself to scold Malcolm, successfully shaming him into taking care of his own son at least the first few times. But eventually that stopped working, so Peter would take Rumple back to his and Malcolm’s home and let himself be convinced into staying overnight because Rumple was too scared to alone, Sacrificing his safety from his own abusive parents to make sure Rumple is okay, but after too many nights spent away from home and the punishment and suspicion from his parents getting worse every time, he makes Rumple a little doll made from straw named Peter Pan to protect him when he’s alone at home at night.

But eventually, the pressure and abuse from his parents gets too much for him so, he leaves in the middle of the night, possibly running away, maybe just getting some air, and he ends up looking up at the second star to the right and making a wish, maybe to be anywhere else, maybe for his parents to be gone, maybe for himself to be gone, and maybe just to forget it all. Then, presumably the blue fairy shows up and she’s like, “Huh, those are some concerning thoughts kiddo here’s some fairy dust” and then she boops his nose, erases his memories like he wished, and gives him some fairy dust to fly away to Neverland, leaving Rumple alone with his father.

Does that hit? Is it good? I like it a lot better than canon.

Once upon a time was addicting but god are there some things I hated even as a kid… like Peter Pan not being a real boy but in fact an old abusive man

[theonceoverthinker]

OUAT 3X06 - Ariel

Who’s ready to hear an amazing TAIL that only slightly FISHY?!

Yeah, yeah. They’re not all winners. Hit me up under the cut to read my thoughts!

Press Release

Back in the Fairy Tale Land that was, when Ariel saves Snow White from drowning in the ocean’s depths, Snow returns the favor by helping her new friend get acquainted with Prince Eric, with whom she has fallen madly in love with. Meanwhile, Emma, Mary Margaret, David and Hook attempt to save Neal, who is imprisoned in one of Pan’s encampments, and Regina and Mr. Gold begrudgingly team up to find a way to take down Pan.

Main Thoughts - Characters/Stories/Themes and Their Effectiveness

Past

Ariel is the main focus of this segment. Her character introduction is the reason for it.

And honestly, that’s pretty great.

I think that’s pretty evident by how much the fandom loves Ariel as a whole. I’ve never met a single person who doesn’t love her and there’s a good reason why. She’s energetic, kind, has a solid introductory story that gives you everything you’ve ever needed to know about her character. Johanna’s performance is so enjoying to watch as she captures the innocence of the character of Ariel as well as the bubbliness that made the Disney version so memorable.

Present

So, we all agree, the main focus of this segment are the secrets. It’s not to say there isn’t more meat there (Ex. Rumple and Regina), but I cover more of it in other segments and my thoughts on the secrets is what you want to hear.

”The deeper the lie, the more truth in its echo.” I guess that means the more you deny the truth to yourself and others, the more true or big it really is.

And to be experimental and do something different (And because I don’t really feel like delving into the revelations that will come to pass in future seasons), I’m going to just focus my review of the present by tackling these secrets as they are and with that mindset in mind:

Killian: Killian reveals that he kissed Emma and that the kiss exposed that he can move on from Milah and love again. I buy this as a secret. To keep this short as to not get too shippy (You can find THAT bit of shippy goodness in it’s home), it makes perfect sense to me that with Killian’s redemption underway and that he’s at least willing to let Rumple live, the idea of him moving on romantically works as both a story concept and a character concept. I also like how he was apparently fighting it at every step of the way, only being fully convinced with last episode’s kiss.

Snow: Snow reveals that for as much as she loves Emma and their life together, she longs for the firsts that were denied to them and thus, wants another baby. I feel like Snow addresses David more with this secret than she does Emma and for the secret of ‘I want another baby/another chance,’ there are too many instances of “our daughter” and not enough “Emma”s for me. Now, with that out of the way, the secret itself is very in-character for Snow. I like it in terms of enjoying it as something very in-character. It’s a believable desire for her to have and Ginny really sells how badly Snow wants it. It’s also heartbreaking for Emma and that de-emphasis on her (Or rather, de-EMMA-sis -- holy shit, that may have been my best pun ever) as she tells it really sticks out because of it. It sucks that this is never brought back up too because this is sort of another case of Emma being told she’s not enough and by her own parents who she saved.

David: David, of course, reveals that he’s trapped on the island. There’s really nothing else to elaborate on here. I like how the focus is on Snow and her anger at the lie is hard and fast. It builds on what she was saying about secrets and honesty in both segments of the episode.

Emma: Finally, Emma reveals that while she’s never stopped loving Neal, the pain of losing him again caused all of the pain from long ago to return with a vengeance, and that rather than being forced to deal with the pain that their past together caused her, she wished that he’d died. Again, I’ll try not to talk about all of the shippy goodness here (Again, there’s more down below), but some will be delved into, so fair warning. Looks like I’m 4/4 because I like this one too. I get that wanting someone to die as their best self seems better than having to come to terms with the complications in their relationship. When Neal “died,” he had just apologized to Emma and made a heroic sacrifice for her and Henry. That was his last impression and believing him to be dead allows for Emma to close the book on the pain that was between them. Him being alive brings those problems to the present and makes them active again and Emma would rather that pain not be the thing that ultimately impacts her memory of Neal the most. I also love Neal’s response and fast forgiveness. For a few episodes now, Neal has been discussing all of his regrets concerning Emma and how he felt about her and that hug really says a lot about just how sorry he is.

Insights - Stream of Consciousness

-”Did you really think you could hide from The Evil Queen?” “Actually, yes.” This line never fails to crack me up! The shrug and surprise in Ginny’s voice really sells it.

-Look at the synchronized swords on those guards! How long do you think they practiced that?

-Damn, the water here is beautiful. The way the lighting is done paints something mystical and yet deadly af!

-”No. There has to be a way without going dark.” No, Emma. Anger does not necessitate going dark. Anger is an emotion that everyone’s entitled to feeling and it’s one that can be a force for good. The way Regina’s teaching you at the moment doesn’t go against that. Coming right after the stellar subplot in “Good Form,” this really is a disappointment to hear from Emma. Emma knows righteous fury better than anyone. That said, I completely agree with this scene for framing Regina as in the right because it’s completely warranted.

-YASSSS! Thank you, Killian for telling the truth about Neal!

-I’m fully with David and Killian here. Emotionally and strategically, it made the most sense to keep Emma in the dark about Neal being alive until they could confirm it.

-”Can you keep a secret?” Fuck no, she can’t!

-”Sorry. She deserved to know.” THEY WERE GOING TO TELL HER THE TRUTH, SNOW! PATIENCE. IT’S A REAL THING.

-Rumple, while trying to look into the future, looks like he’s either trying to summon a Final Flash from DBZ or the Doctor Strange magic hands.

-I spend a lot of time thinking about Rumple and his future telling abilities and why they never came up after this season. Like, I honestly don’t care that much about plot holes, but they can matter when they’re character-based. When a character has a power like that (One that’s been established since the pilot), there needs to be a reason for them not to use it, and Rumple, who has an over-reliance on magic as a major character trait, would use that as often as he could. In Neverland, Pan made it clear why he couldn't. But why not afterwards? Is the power just that vague that we can infer that he was using it? My personal HC is that they just went away after his first death.

-Okay, Pan is the one hell of a villain, but he’s also one hell of a chef, too! No wonder Fiona loved him!

-”You’ve lost your son Neal. Again.” You’re such an asshole, Pan, but it is like the greatest thing to watch.

-Okay, so real talk: I have misophonia and loud chewing and talking with one’s mouthful often enrages me. And Pan didn’t! I was ready to cringe when he picked up that egg in a basket, but he was fine. Pan, you may be the villain of this arc, but you’re the Savior to my ears! Thank you, Robbie Kay for enunciating properly as you eat!

-”That by killing you, all our troubles end?” Rumple: Sass Master Extraordinaire.

-Okay, so it looks like Rumple specifically has to die to kill Pan. Da fuq?

-”Have you forgiven YOUR father?” Wow, the writers of this show were just milking that twist with everything they had, didn’t they?

-”She looks fertile.” I repeat: Da fuq?

-I feel like I’d hate Snow a lot more in this episode if it weren’t for her tracking abilities finally being put to good use.

-I like Regina’s decision to leave the group from a character perspective. While the group should definitely try to save Neal, Regina, who doesn’t care about him would have no interest and after the second stop in their journey AND after talking to Henry, I can understand how all that frustration would just explode at the thought of another deviation.

-”It [the fork] is really not that valuable.” I don’t know. That is a really well made fork. XD

-”I may be heartbroken, but I’ll understand.” People, I give you Prince Eric: The only true unproblematic fave.

-Ooh! That mirror transition effect from the party to Regina’s castle was amazing!

-”Come home to Storybrooke.” Rumple, that’s as big of a red flag as there can be that that’s not Belle!

-”Are you really going to fall for this?” My sentiments exactly, Regina!

-You know, this is some great acting on Emilie’s part! She has to pull off a suffocation scene as the victim with no physical help from another actor. She really sells fake Belle’s desperation and panic!

-Speaking of good acting, look at Robert’s face when he discovers that Pan’s shadow was fake Belle. For the first time, we see a full display of the true fear Rumple has for his father!

-For as much as I’m apprehensive about Snow in the present segments, I’m LOVING her in the past. She’s so kind and supportive.

-”Thanks. For nothin’.” A little ungrateful there, aren’t you, Ariel?

-I giggled for a good twenty seconds at Regina saying “Ah-riel!”

-”You’re not gonna die at anyone’s hands but my own.” Honestly, Rumple dies at EVERYONE’S hands but your own!

-”Because I came here to kill him and die in the process!” Rumple, you are so fucking extra! Still bring the freakin’ weapon! You are so gloriously extra!

-Lana is having such a fun time playing Regina playing Ursula and I’m loving it! XD

-I took another five second giggle at “Dil-EMMA.”

-”I lost half my crew inside those rock walls.” Wow. This has gotta hurt.

-”He believes once we do [Reveal our secrets], we’ll destroy each other.” I love how this just doesn’t happen. It threatens to happen, but the strength of the group is strong enough to overcome them.

-Okay, so Snow’s a total boss during this Regina confrontation! Not only is she once again completely supportive of Ariel, BUT she decides to egg on Regina as much as she can before dying at her hands by saying that she’ll never be happy. For this point in Regina’s life, it’s an incredibly satisfying sight to see.

-SAME GOES FOR ARIEL! She fucking stabs Regina in the neck! WITH A FORK! Not even Snow or Charming could do that with a sword!

-”I don’t know the particulars. Only what I’ve been told.” So Killian didn’t go in?

-I love the video game that is the Echo Caves!

-”You know that’s not how this works.” Emma’s reaction to this line is just the best, her body screaming “can’t blame me for trying.”

-Anyone feel like if they were trapped in the Echo Cave that they wouldn’t know their own deepest secrets?

-REGINA! FUCK YOU! It’s an amazing evil plan and as a viewer, I’m loving this, but for breaking Ariel’s spirit, FUCK YOU!

-Real Ursula. Both powerful and kinky as all hell. <3

-”Storybrooke.” Regina’s so proud of the name, and to be fair, quite rightly!

Arcs - How Are These Storylines Progressing?

The Mission to Save Henry - We have a way of defeating Pan! XD Once again, the main plot focuses on something else than this mission, but I don’t think it was a bad idea. The subplot keeps the momentum going quite nicely.  

Killian’s Redemption - GREAT on Killian for telling the truth about Neal! That’s really the biggest point here, but it’s an important one nonetheless that speaks to how seriously he’s taking his redemption. He doesn’t hesitate telling her family and only keeps Emma in the dark temporarily as to spare her further pain.

Regina’s Redemption - Regina gets some great moments here! First, how she teaches Emma is fantastic! Like, I’m so glad that she showed the value of anger and how it and darkness are not necessarily one and the same! Second, she saves Rumple’s ass! Third, “maybe we can find another way.” The third way has been the heroes philosophy for a while and to see Regina trying that outlook rather than sacrificing Rumple is a nice bit of foreshadowing to her eventual fates and abilities! I actually think Regina may be in her best form this season! She’s still snippy and hates everyone, but she’s focused on doing right by her son. Because of that, she’ll use the darkness for the noble cause of saving him, and rather than waste time (As she puts it), she’ll look for faster means when working with those that are good isn’t making what she deems as acceptable progress.

Rumple’s Redemption - Despite Neal’s betrayal and his doubts from “Nasty Habits,” Rumple is still sincerely all in for his redemption, as much as he can be, at least. His self preservation habit is still eating at him, making him trust more in Shadow Belle, and it really works!

Favorite Dynamic

Regina and Rumple. Regina came to Rumple at just the right time. She dragged him fighting and screaming away from danger and self loathing and back to reality and the point of this mission. It’s actually a great relief to see Rumple again with someone who won’t take any of his shit. Characters like that challenge Rumple and with Regina, it allows for us to see just what happens when they combine their dark magic and few fucks together for a good cause. It’s as Regina says: “We’re the two most powerful practitioners of magic who have ever lived. The Evil Queen and The Dark One joining forces? I’d say we can find another way of handling some smug teenager.” And together, they’re effective at coming up with a real strategy to defeat that smug teenager!

Writer

Adam and Eddy are “Ariel’s” writers and I really like what they did here. All three stories are balanced well, everyones motivations are really understandable in the present and that fits the framing of everyone being sympathetic, and the material in the past is just engaging.

Rating

10/10. It’s a great episode! Ariel is a compelling character and watching her learn the value of honesty is a nice story that cleanly fits Snow and Regina into it. The present really delves into the further conflicts of the main characters and shows how honesty can be both an aid and a curse. The episode itself is given nuance because of that and the sets of interactions chose for the most part do a lot of good for expanding on the character’s mindsets. Also, as you’ll see below, this episode is FILLED TO THE BRIM WITH SHIPPY GOODNESS!

Flip My Ship - The Home of All Things “Shippy Goodness”

Captain Swan - I think it says so much about how Killian cares for Emma that he’s willing to tell her family immediately that Neal’s alive, only holding out on telling Emma herself so that they can confirm it and save her from more pain. Pan said it himself: There is a good chance Emma won’t return his affections after its revealed that Neal’s alive. But he does it anyway because he knows how devastated she was from his loss. Whether you believe he’s completely in love with her or not, that is what caring for another person truly is. Also, look at how Emma looks to Killian to confirm whether or not that’s true when the beans are spilled (Thanks, Snow). She really does trust him now! And on Emma’s side, she actually tells her mom she kissed Hook! “I was feeling good.” And she says it in such a gossipy practically bursting way! It’s not-at-all giddy, but still a little giddy at the same time! And when Snow asks her if it meant anything, she says “i-it was just a kiss,” but everything from her tone to the fact that she actually told someone about this kiss means that it definitely was more! Now let’s talk about the Echo Cave. Killian reveals his secret and Emma’s first response is “It’s just a kiss.” But just look at the vulnerability in her eyes! And the first panel comes roaring out once he reveals what it fully meant to him! Truth! And as Emma goes towards Neal, there’s this dark acceptance in him, but it’s a respectful possible resignation.

Swan Fire - I genuinely adore how soft Neal is with Emma. The entire time he’s in his cage, he gives Emma gentle nudges in the right direction and oodles of comfort. And Emma’s confession to never stop loving Neal was beautiful. Jen’s performance here is just beautiful, soft and tender features all around as she admits that. And even as she’s admitting that she wished Neal was dead, she’s crying, clearly wishing to herself that it wasn’t true because of the love she has for him. And what’s Neal’s response to this when he gets out? An IMMEDIATE hug. It’s a tender, desperate, emotional hug. I actually found myself choked up here. He completely understands what she means. Emma gives this genuine apology for how she feels and Neal just gets it. And he’s still going to fight for her.

Ariel/Eric - Damn, Eric is romantic af! He cares about no one’s thoughts but Ariel’s and it’s really charming. “If I want to dance, I can.” <3 I almost find it a touch too forward for him to ask her to explore the world with her after one date, but given that they’re going full in on the Love at First Sight trope and Ariel says twice that she wanted to see the world, it works! He’s also a full on gentleman, stepping back (Literally) the second he feels she might decline for her comfort and even says” “I’m pressuring you: That’s unfair!” The dude’s an honest-to-goodness heartthrob! And Ariel really cares about him too! She doesn’t want him to be forced to choose between her and his dreams. And together, they’re just a cute, optimistic, lovey-dovey pair!

Millian - Short blurb, but I think it really says something about the depth of Killian’s feelings for Milah that he could NOT move on from her for over a century and when he finally found someone, he had to kiss her to finally push the denial out of his system. Like, that’s some powerful love.

Snowing - “At least not with me.” Okay, so David definitely lied and that sucks, but holy shit. In this one line, David gave his blessing for Snow not only to move on, but to have another child with someone else. And that’s gotta hurt! Like, LOVE! That’s love!

-----

This review was admittedly much shorter than I usually make them, and I’m sorry, but not too sorry because ONCE CON!!!! If you want to keep up with my con adventures, I’ll try posting some pics to my Instagram, protochan44, and hell, maybe I’ll do a live video at some point! And yeah, I’ll probably post some shenanigans on my blog too! But yeah, I am so excited and also pretty relieved that I was able to get through all of these!

Thanks for reading and thank you to the beautiful folks at @watchingfairytales, at least two of whom I’ll be meeting either tonight or tomorrow! Next time, we hit up “Dark Hollow!”

Season 3 Total (59/220)

Writer’s Scores: Adam and Eddy (19/60) Kalinda Vazquez (10/40) Andrew Chambliss (10/50) Jane Espenson (10/30) David Goodman (10/40) Robert Hull (10/40) Christine Boylan (10/20) Daniel Thomsen (10/30)

Operation Rewatch Archives

[thebigmick284]

OUAT 7x21 thoughts as I watch

It’s the final countdown...

*This opening just makes me wonder what happened to Violet and Henry’s relationship with her.

*So how does Wish Rumple know all about Henry anyway? It is cool to see young Henry interacting with full on scaley DO Rumple though.

*The O in the titlecard being a portal is cool. And we’re back to the standard S1-S6 titlecard not the S7 one.

*This Alice and Wish Hook scene is full of feels. I don’t understand why their curse is still in affect given Gothel is now a tree? Oh well...

*Sigh, I almost wish we got a Season 8 just so we could have had more Facilier...

*I also assumed given they stopped Gothel, that her bringing magic plan failed... Guess not.

*Aww cupcake/Emma reference...

*So Wish Rumple can just...poof people to other worlds?

*So why are the wish and regular versions linked anyway?

*loved Wish Rumple using that old desperate soul line.

*’We don’t negotiate with villains. We kick ass and protect the people we love’. This would have been a great Emma line.

*’Captain Hook is ready to go back home’. Love it.

*So Tiana has the whole Snow ‘we are both’ affliction. Nice little scene. Does feel a bit strange seeing Naveen and her get all cosy when they barely even knew each other in the EF2.0.

*Seriously, I know it’s to save money but using the same portal special effects each time is getting old, lol.

*Nice seeing Wish Pan... even if it was just exposition. Robbie Kay still has that presence. But it just makes me think... we know there was a Wish Bae... what happened to him. And we saw that giant portrait of him in the Wish Charming’s castle. Ugh... as much as I like Wish Hook and Alice, this all feels like lazy writing having various versions of each characters and without much backstory.

*’All I see is a cave where booze goes to perish’ I don’t know why but that was funny.

*This episode is so plot filled again... ugh I was hoping the finale would be like S3′s finale with no villain drama.  But those hopes were dashes last week with the return of Wish Rumple...

*Nice seeing Wish Ariel too..

*Again this is exactly what I’m talking about with Wish Cruella. Regina and Henry don’t know this Cruella but they act like it’s the old Cruella.

*That sword fight was so hilariously lacklustre

*TBH Wish Rumple is pretty boring...

*No use complaining to Rumple and Regina about happy endings, Henry. They’re the biggest whitewashed ex villains in this show.

*Guess they didn’t have enough money to have the special effects for the squid ink?

*Did they forget Wish Rumple also loved a Wish Belle?

*Kinda cool bringing up the Seer’s prophecy.

*Good job Regina screwing things up...

*Does Wish Rumple want normal Rumple’s dagger because it has the powers of all the DOs? They really haven’t explained what he wants.

*Haha Wish Apprentice’s words about the timeline and complicated story. It’s not that OUAT is complicated it’s just post S3 they just cared about introducing new plots without ever resolving elements of the previous ones.

*So this is confusing... I take it EVERYTHING that happened to the Wish versions of each character is exactly like the original counterparts? So when the Evil Queen made the wish in S6, it made duplicates of EACH world?

*At least they brought up Regina killing the Wish Charmings

*So much plot. Alice is able to sense her papa in danger in another world, this Remy guy just having a bean...

*But shouldn’t this be Storybrooke in the past?

*Overall in many ways this felt like an old school OUAT, but it was just so plot filled, the only somewhat decent character scene was with Tiana and Naveen and by large I found the episode very uninspiring...

Hoping the best for the finale next week.